[Domesteading 00169] Re: Discussion reinitiates hexayurt

[J & D Goldman]

Vinay,
   A few follow up points:

On aluminum, my jaunts to the local salvage yards have taught me that
thin aluminum sheets are regularly recycled from print shops. They
have huge piles of aluminum sheets that would make a good skin.  I
wonder if this is available outside the US.  Also, for metals like
this, you might be interested in some of the newer adhesives now
available on the market.  In one case, the adhesive is replacing the
rivets used to join sections of semi trailer boxes.  Apparently its
more reliable than the rivets, cheaper and faster also. Would that be
useful for your structures?

On waterproofing paper, I'll forward some of the things I sent out
earlier, and add a few new ones later.  A bit of a shame about Global,
I don't know what is happening with them.  Does Pregis not have any
options for you on that?

1)Michelman - the guys with the paperboard kayaks.
2)Also Stone Container's BlocKit 1220, which they claim is recycable.
3) Polysupreme.  It's not biodegradable, but it is promoted as 100%
recycleable and repulpable. Currently it is being used for poultry
boxes and bulk bins.  Unlike waxed boxes, the user does not need
special disposal, so its becoming very popular and saves money in the
commercial sector.  I actually discussed the prospect of using this
material for emergency housing with one of the principles in the
company, and there was some interest at the time.

See www.polysupreme.com material made by:
 Evco research,
http://www.evco-research.com/1/contact.asp
EvCo Research, inc.
4200 Northside Parkway, NW,
14 North Parkway Square,
Atlanta, GA 30327
Tel: 404-240-0069
Fax: 404-816-6512

One of the hinge materials I have in mind is the polyprop batten strip
and hinge.  I'll see if I can get you a web link.

I tried working on a wiki once before and did not have good luck with
it, but I should try again. For now I figure some of the people on
this list might find the leads interesting, so I'd post on both.  If
your friend Woody likes that, have him get in touch.  There is more
where that came from...  :-)

- Dan G.

-----Original Message-----
From: Vinay Gupta <hexayurt at gmail.com>
To: A forum for the discussion of aspects of independent,off-the-grid
living <domesteading at sculptors.com>
Date: Sunday, April 08, 2007 8:56 PM
Subject: [Domesteading 00167] Re: Discussion reinitiates hexayurt


>On Apr 9, 2007, at 1:21 AM, J & D Goldman wrote:
>
>> This link may work better than the .doc.
>>
>>
http://depts.washington.edu/dmgftp/publications/uist04/flexm_uist04_11
>> .pdf
>
>Sorry I missed your earlier message, Dan. It's been a hectic day!
>
>>>  I finally got a chance to look at the hexayurt materials and the
>>> websites on the housing/archit project. Very interesting and an
>>> impressive level of simplicity.
>
>Glad you like the design. It's taken a while to get it down this far
:)
>
>Did you see the folding video? Really gives a sense of where we're at
>right now, and what the next steps might be!
>
>http://files.howtolivewiki.com/folding_hexayurt/
>warner_folding_hexayurt_clip.mp4
>
>(or, if you don't have quicktime, about 4 minutes into this:
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMHACXotJAk )
>
>It's a manufacturable one-piece folding building.
>
>>> We had many discussions here on this list about materials for dome
>>> panels.  If you check the archive you will find quite a bit.
Sanford
>>> Ponder and some of his associates were working on The Pod and we
>>> looked at some of the coating options available to make paper
weather
>>> resistant, some of which were recyclable or biodegradeable.  Have
you
>>> looked into this and does the honeycomb company you are working
with
>>> have anything available to make the paper more waterproof?  One
such
>>> possiblility would be to use an adhesive to apply PLA plastic film
>>> (made from corn starch) to paper.  UV inhibitor might be an issue,
>> but
>>> feasible. We also talked about some of the soy based materials
used
>>> for insulation which might be a candidate for a honeycomb panel.
>>> There is also some pretty good corrugated plastic out now that can
be
>>> a good surface material or cross grained to make a strong light
>> panel.
>
>My feeling on this is to go with metal. A good thick aluminium foil
>is probably a lot more durable than other options and my guess is a
>good deal more recyclable and just maybe a bit less polluting (I say
>that with some trepidation, but it might be true.)
>
>I talked to the folks from Global Village Shelters about their
>waterproofed triplewall at some point and they flat out refused to
>tell me what it was, and said they had an exclusive deal with
>Weyerhauser and we would not be able to buy it.
>
>I thought that, given that we are giving away our technology for free
>- no patent, no IP protection - all Public Domain - it was mean
>spirited in the extreme. They wouldn't even discuss it.
>
>>> For panel joining, sounds like the tape works pretty well, but if
you
>>> are interested in other hinge materials, I think there are some
other
>>> options that may outlast the tape.  One concern in some climates
is
>>> snow load and wind, so the building would need to be structurally
>>> superior to those adequate for mild climates.
>>> I find some materials in greenhouse technology that might be
useful
>>> that way.
>
>Interesting. Do you have any specific examples? I'm not a gardener so
>I know next to nothing about greenhouse materials.
>
>>> In addition, here is an item that might give the public domain
people
>>> some useful ideas for a folding structure.  It uses a hinge and
pin
>>> lock to make an umbrella-folding arrangment which should work well
>>> with triangular panel structures.
>
>That's extremely cool and I've forwarded it to Woody, our informatics
>guy. We don't use corner structures because the panel material is
>useless for point loading - it's just no good - so it's all
>connection of edges. But as a concept these aware hinges are
>fascinating!
>
>I'd love to see more goodies from the files - yes please! - and I'd
>invite you to start a page on the Wiki if there are concepts you
>would like to share with people in the Hexayurt community.
>
>:-)
>
>Cool!
>
>Vinay
>
>
>
>>>
http://depts.washington.edu/dmgftp/publications/uist04/flexm_uist04_0
>> 2
>>> .doc
>>> Popsicle stick hubs
>>>
>>> If you are interested in more of this, let me know. I can go back
>>> through the files and pull out more items that might spark some
ideas
>>> in others.
>>>
>>> - Dan G.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Vinay Gupta <hexayurt at gmail.com>
>>> To: A forum for the discussion of aspects of
independent,off-the-grid
>>> living <domesteading at sculptors.com>
>>> Date: Wednesday, April 04, 2007 12:20 PM
>>> Subject: [Domesteading 00144] Re: Discussion reinitiates
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 3, 2007, at 3:00 AM, J & D Goldman wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The tools are cheaper than they ever
>>>>> were (compount miters sell for peanuts now), and the materials
are
>>>>> improving, with more biodegradeable structural choices appearing
>>>>> daily.  I'm still impressed with honeycomb panels for low
weight,
>>> high
>>>>> strength and superior insulation.
>>>>
>>>> We've been working with Hexacomb cardboard very successfully for
the
>>>> super low priced hexayurts - which are basically simplified
>>>> geodesics. We've got a lot of interest from the US DOD - the
Marine
>>>> Corps has a project going to get the technology written up as a
>> Field
>>>> Manual, among other things.
>>>>
>>>> Open Source and no patents has really enabled us to get these
things
>>>> spread. If you haven't examined the designs, they are very
simple.
>>>> Cut 6 4x8 panels in half on the diagonals, assemble into six 8x8
>>>> isosceles triangles, and use whole 4x8 panels for the walls.
Whole
>>>> thing goes together with an adhesive backed composite from 3M
(i.e.
>>>> 6" wide 8959 tape, $12 a roll, 600 lb break.)
>>>>
>>>> It's that simple, and it works. You can even make them folding.
>>>>
>>>> http://files.howtolivewiki.com/folding_hexayurt/
>>>> warner_folding_hexayurt_clip.mp4
>>>>
>>>> http://youtube.com/results?search_query=hexayurt&search=Search
(more
>>>> assembly videos)
>>>>
>>>> I think this is the way to get geodesics restarted.
>>>>
>>>> Vinay
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Vinay Gupta - Designer, Hexayurt Project - an excellent public
>> domain
>>>> refugee shelter system
>>>> Gizmo Project VOIP: 775-743-1851 (usually works!)
Cell:
>>>> Iceland (+354) 869-4605
>>>> http://howtolivewiki.com/hexayurt - old
>>> http://appropedia.org/
>>>> Hexayurt_Project - new
>>>> Skype/Gizmo/Gtalk: hexayurt   I have a proof which unfortunately
>> this
>>>> signature is too short
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Now you can even get concrete that
>>>>> is light permeable so it glows during the day.
>>>>>
>>>>> - Dan G.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Chris <bewise at hypertech.net>
>>>>> To: A forum for the discussion of aspects of
>>> independent,off-the-grid
>>>>> living <domesteading at sculptors.com>
>>>>> Date: Monday, April 02, 2007 8:43 PM
>>>>> Subject: [Domesteading 00136] Re: Information
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hey... I'll chime in her to say that I've received nada from
this
>>>>> list for
>>>>>> quite some time... then suddenly y'all struck up this
>>> conversation...
>>>>> Me
>>>>>> thinks that, perhaps, this list may not return a copy to the
>>> sender
>>>>> of their
>>>>>> own post??? Anyway, I'll soon find out <smile>. In the interim,
>>>>> perhaps all
>>>>>> y'all (which is gramatically correct Ozark Redneck
>> Southernese ---
>>>>> just in
>>>>>> case you didn't know <laffin>) will enjoy the news release
>> (below)
>>>>> about an
>>>>>> energy.climate event we're coordinating April 14th. Wish I'd of
>>>>> thought to
>>>>>> tell ya about it sooner... It would be great to have somebody
>>> there
>>>>> stumping
>>>>>> for the energy efficiency of domes... ~Christine
>>>>>>
>>>>>> DATELINE: March 31, 2007
>>>>>> Citing EPA statistics, "The U.S. emits over 7.6
thousand-million
>>>>> metric tons
>>>>>> of greenhouse gases annually,"  Ruth Reynolds, coordinator of
the
>>>>> Step It Up
>>>>>> Hardy Town Meeting, worries.  Inspired by the National Day of
>>> Climate
>>>>> Action
>>>>>> scheduled for April 14th "Step It Up 2007",  Reynolds and
several
>>>>> friends
>>>>>> are organizing the energy/climate awareness event being held
that
>>>>> Saturday
>>>>>> in The Olde Hardy Gym, 203 School Street, Hardy, Arkansas.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "The world is already committed to an eventual half-degree
>> Celsius
>>>>> (about
>>>>>> one degree Fahrenheit) temperature increase," Reynolds
continued.
>>>>>> "Day-by-day greenhouse gases relentlessly build up in the
>>> atmosphere,
>>>>>> committing us to ever greater temperature increases. On and on
>>> goes
>>>>> the list
>>>>>> of compelling reasons to quickly enact a plethora of strong
>> energy
>>>>>> legislation, including a federal mandate to reduce greenhouse
>>> gases
>>>>>> emissions 80% below 1990 levels by 2050."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Open discussion of this 'list of compelling reasons' is the
focal
>>>>> point of
>>>>>> the all-day gathering in Hardy, which opens at 10am with Vendor
&
>>>>>> Educational displays and demonstrations that explore ways to
save
>>>>> energy,
>>>>>> reduce heat-trapping gases emissions, and ensure energy and
food
>>>>> security.
>>>>>> Featured technologies offer ways to increase fuel and household
>>>>> energy
>>>>>> efficiency, eliminate waste, and make every drop of energy work
>>> for
>>>>> the
>>>>>> common good.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Town Meeting Agenda, which convenes promptly at 12:00 noon,
>>> will
>>>>> be
>>>>>> officiated by Hardy Mayor Nina Thornton. Featured Speakers and
>>> Topics
>>>>>> include:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Significant Quotes," Ruth Reynolds, Coordinator of Step It Up
>>> Hardy
>>>>> 2007,
>>>>>> President of Save Our Spring River, and Member of the Sharp
>> County
>>>>> Recycling
>>>>>> Center Executive Board, will address the range of attitudes
about
>>>>> Global
>>>>>> Warming in opening remarks.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "God's Dream," Reverend Gary Goldman, native Arkansan from
>>> Texarkana,
>>>>>> graduate of Henderson College and Saint Paul School of
Theology,
>>>>> alumnus of
>>>>>> Hendrix College and Harvard School of Business, retired United
>>> Method
>>>>> ist
>>>>>> minister now appointed part-time with the Horseshoe Bend United
>>>>> Methodist
>>>>>> Church, will speak to the responsibility of environmental
>>>>> stewardship.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "The Greenhouse Effect," Dr. Lawrence Coleman, a tenacious
>>> scientist
>>>>>> affiliated since 1969 with University of Arkansas at Little
Rock
>>>>> (UALR)
>>>>>> Department of Physics and Astronomy, has given talks statewide
on
>>> the
>>>>>> science of global warming and the physics of the greenhouse
>>> effect.
>>>>> His talk
>>>>>> is augmented by a Power Point presentation. "Melting glaciers,
>>>>> earlier
>>>>>> springs, vanishing polar ice. these things have all happened in
>>> the
>>>>> past. So
>>>>>> the real question is Why are they happening now?  Why do
>>> scientists
>>>>> believe
>>>>>> that humans are now causing global warming and, more
importantly,
>>>>> what can
>>>>>> be done to avoid the worst effects by acting responsibly,
>>> rationally
>>>>> and
>>>>>> soon?"
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "A World of Possibilities," Sandie Cloud, member of the Board
of
>>>>> Directors
>>>>>> serving as head of the Retail Committee of the Hemp Industries
>>>>> Association
>>>>>> (HIA), and proprietor of For Mother Earth Norfork and For
Mother
>>>>> Earth
>>>>>> Hardy, will address the carbon-neutral possibilities of hemp as
>> an
>>>>>> environmentally and economically friendly resource for fuel,
>> food,
>>>>> fabric
>>>>>> and building materials.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "BioEnergy," Ron Bell, Vice President of the Arkansas
Association
>>> of
>>>>>> Resource Conservation and Development Council (RC&D), Chairman
of
>>> the
>>>>>> Arkansas Energy Office, Bioenergy Services Contractor and
Farmer
>>> will
>>>>>> address ongoing developments of the North Central Arkansas
>>> Bioenergy
>>>>>> Program, the Central Arkansas Biodiesel Infrastructure Project
>> and
>>>>> The
>>>>>> Arkansas Bioenergy Policy Council in the endeavor to replace
>>>>> fossil-fuels
>>>>>> with renewable/sustainable agricultural products.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Town Meeting will conclude with a "Q & A Forum," moderated
by
>>>>> Mayor
>>>>>> Thornton taking comments and questions from the floor addressed
>> to
>>>>> these and
>>>>>> other topical experts, including Robert Reed of American Spirit
>>>>> Energy Homes
>>>>>> and Christine Beems of Gozarks, followed by the hallmark
>> signature
>>>>> action of
>>>>>> every nationally affiliated Step It Up 2007 event: a public
>> 'photo
>>>>> op' to
>>>>>> stand in support of the nationwide rally of over a thousand
>> unique
>>>>> events
>>>>>> and activities being held this same day, stumping for Congress
to
>>> cut
>>>>> CO2
>>>>>> emissions 80% by 2050.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Subsequent to the photo-op, exhibit and vendor booths will
reopen
>>>>> until 4pm
>>>>>> when the program concludes with a Drum Ceremony and the Award
of
>>> Door
>>>>>> Prizes, including such environmentally friendly things as
>>> fluorescent
>>>>> light
>>>>>> bulbs, organically grown garlic, potted plants, and gift
>>> certificates
>>>>> for
>>>>>> ecologically healthy merchandise.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I wish to extend special thanks to all the volunteers who are
>>> making
>>>>> this
>>>>>> event happen," Reynolds acknowledged. "Reasons why people
become
>>>>>> environmentalists are various. I'm just thankful that a few of
>>> them
>>>>> had the
>>>>>> time and inclination to help stage our local rally. It is
>> exciting
>>> to
>>>>> be one
>>>>>> of thousands of Step it Up participants who believe we must
find
>>> and
>>>>>> implement the ways and means to control and diminish our
>> seemingly
>>>>>> insatiable addiction to fossil-fuels. Saturday, April 14th, is
a
>>> good
>>>>> day to
>>>>>> send this message to Congress."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All Step It Up Hardy activities are open, free of charge, to
the
>>>>> general
>>>>>> public. Picnic lunches are welcome and lawn chairs are
>> encouraged.
>>>>> Bleacher
>>>>>> seating is available, first come, first serve. For more
>>> information,
>>>>> visit
>>>>>> www.StepItUp2007.org or  www.LocalEnergyMatters.info or contact
>>> Ruth
>>>>>> Reynolds, 870-257-4596. ~~~~
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: "ROBERT VANCE" <naptimeatv at msn.com>
>>>>>> To: <domesteading at sculptors.com>
>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 3:28 PM
>>>>>> Subject: [Domesteading 00135] Re: Information
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sal,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks for the response! No, I haven't abandoned the domelist
>> but
>>>>> it seems
>>>>>>> that I am no longer connected to it! In that case, if you have
>>> any
>>>>> idea on
>>>>>>> how I can re-connect to it - please let me know! I've sent
some
>>>>> messages
>>>>>>> to the address that I have but haven't received anything in
>>>>> return -
>>>>>>> including the list itself!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bob Vance
>>>>>>> mailto:naptimeatv at msn.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Sal Cerda <sal.cerda at rocketmail.com>
>>>>>>>> Reply-To: "A forum for the discussion of aspects of
>>>>>>>> independent,off-the-grid living" <domesteading at sculptors.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "A forum for the discussion of aspects of
>>>>> independent,off-the-grid
>>>>>>>> living" <domesteading at sculptors.com>
>>>>>>>> Subject: [Domesteading 00133] Re: Information
>>>>>>>> Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2007 19:09:34 -0700 (PDT)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hey there Robert.
>>>>>>>> I don't know the answer to your questions, but I do know that
>> we
>>>>> miss you
>>>>>>>> over at the domelist.  Hope you haven't abandoned us.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sal
>>>>>>>> Than
>>>>>>>> Robert Vance <naptimeatv at msn.com> wrote: The instructions are
>>> clear
>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> post information and access the archives but how do I get
daily
>>>>>>>> submissions?
>>>>>>>> Bob Vance
>>>>>>>> mailto:naptimeatv at msn.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------
>>>>>>>> Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels
>>>>>>>> in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>>>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>>>>>>> Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.24/742 - Release
Date:
>>>>> 4/1/2007
>>>>>>> 8:49 PM
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>